08.05.07 / Porn Debate / The Pabst Theater /

[DocM]

Pornography is a multi-billion dollar industry in the United States alone, but serious discussion of the issue is rare. Is it degrading to women, or empowering? Is it an addictive and destructive habit, or a window to a fun fantasy world? Featuring Porn King Ron Jeremy vs. Porn Pastor Craig Gross, this intelligent and multi-faceted debate addresses all aspects of the pornography issue.

You may know Ron Jeremy as the world's best known adult film star, appearing in over 1800 films and directing more than 100 more, or you may know him from his appearances on VH1's The Surreal Life. Ron is quite informed and articulate on the subject and his industry's practices to keep it safe and responsible.

Craig Gross is the founder of XXXChurch.com, the largest anti-porn website on the Internet with over 70 Million visitors in the first 4 years of its existence. Today, XXXChurch.com averages 1 million visitors a month. Craig has written 4 books and is a sought after speaker across the country.

Ron and Craig will have time for question and answer built into the debate to ensure that you have the full experience of the Porn Debate.

http://www.porndebate.com/

[farzad]

ron jeremy defending the truth. 

yeesh   

[DocM]

i think i'm gonna go cover this one... i'm actually expecting it to be fairly interesting.
and while i do not watch a whole lot of ron jeremy porn, i have thought he was pretty awesome since he played Jizz Master Zero in Orgazmo (that porno comedy by the South Park guys.)

[jemitu]

and while i do not watch a whole lot of ron jeremy porn, i have thought he was pretty awesome since he played Jizz Master Zero in Orgazmo (that porno comedy by the South Park guys.)

exactly how much ron jeremy porn do you watch?  and for releative measurement purposes, what would you call "a whole lot"?   

[farzad]

a whole lot is 5 times a day.  a bit is twice per day.  that's the secret guy code.

[DocM]

I think, maybe once, I saw an actual Ron Jeremy porn. And I did watch some of the documentary about him a few years back. That's really it. Frankly, I find Ron to be pretty gross...

[jemitu]

two pornos in one day?  i'm going to assume you skip past the "story" parts

i think all men in porn are gross, but i would agree that ron jeremy is especially gross.  i am not sad that i have not ever seen him in action.

[Olga]

I watched  few years ago the documentary about him. If you look over the fact that he is indeed gross, what you see is a very lonely person dying to belong. It might sound naive but I think he is a good person stuck in this evil industry (not that I don`t appreciate porn but not Jenna Jameson  spitting dirty talk crap). I felt bad for the guy after I saw the documentary.
Anyway, I don`t think he is particularly smart , I`m just curious to see how the other guy will approach the subject so I`m gonna go.

[farzad]

so who won 'the debate' and how did it go?

[Olga]

Brian will write and post an article about the debate later today.


And you and me, Farzi, need couple of hours to be in good terms again 

[farzad]

i've got nothing but love olga.   ron on the other hand may have something else in store for you =D

[farzad]

oh stop it 

[DocM]

The Porn Debate. Featuring Porn King Ron Jeremy and Porn Pastor Craig Gross.
by Mike Thomas

What do you normally do on Sunday evenings this time of year? Go to an evening church service? Tend to your garden? Or perhaps enjoy a little wine on the porch while watching fireflies dance in the dark? Or for a slight change of scenery attend a debate between the world's most infamous pornographer and the wold's most famous anti-porn pastor? Fireflies, porn debate. Fireflies, porn debate. What kind of a choice is that anyway? If only there was a way to do both.

In the darkened Pabst Theater Ron Jeremy and Criag Gross were introduced and took their positions behind lecterns flanking the moderator. Each debater started with a 15 minute setup of their positions on pornography. This was followed by back and forth debating—each attempting to grab the top of the morality bat. Questions from the audience followed. The debate concluded with final opinions from the two noted debaters. But who won? Let's explore, shall we?

Porn Pastor Craig Gross seemed sincere and actually very warm. So did the better-known king of porn, Ron Jeremy. Mr. Jeremy's overall approach to the debate was vastly entertaining and expectedly vulgar. In a direct question about what God must think about pornography Mr. Jeremy said, "God doesn't have a problem with porn." Mr. Gross's rebuttal was not as pointed as some would expect from a religious figure. Just that pornography is not the path of the religious minded. Surprisingly Mr. Gross did not suggest that we end pornography nor did he suggest that adults didn't have the right to view it, which ultimately diffused much of the tension that could have existed in the room. At that point the most pronounced peculiarity was more visual in nature. Ron is the King of Porn. And he looks like a sort of hippie Super Mario while the Porn Pastor looked like he could actually be a porn star. Is something out of whack with this image? The unexpected was not to end with appearances either.

Overall Mr. Gross' arguments were that porn isn't good because it isn't real. It is pure fantasy and that places unrealistic expectations on its audience. He asked rhetorically, "How can any of us live up to these images of how people are portrayed in pornography?" He pointed to several outrageous titles. Sited that pornography is harmful to its participants as well, citing one woman even needed reconstructive surgery to her anus. Jeremy's rebuttal to these seemed fair enough and ultimately more tenable. These examples were not logical and that the fringe isn't really the point of the debate. Who wouldn't say that reconstructive surgery of someone's anus is a very bad thing? Further Mr. Jeremy pointed out that all media was filled with ideals that were difficult to live up to. "Why pick on porn?" Ron exclaimed, "By that logic we should ban nude beaches and most of Hollywood!"

Still, fringe arguments were thrown about from both sides. Everything from debating the merits of something referred to as "analingus" to the once-legal practice of sex surrogates helping people such as the disabled who couldn't otherwise meet a partner. About the only thing not discussed was so called Japanese air sex. Google that. Unless you're a Christian. Then you're better off Googling R.C. Sproul. He's the opposite of Japanese air sex.

Toward the end of the debate everyone seemed to be scratching their heads. What was the point of this debate? Perhaps we were expecting some sort of ultimate confrontation. But there was none to speak of. Toward the end both debaters admitted to becoming friends on their tour bus. Respect between a preacher and a pornographer? Wait a minute. What's really going on here?

Then the questions from the audience came in via sms messages from there phone as well as directly from raised hands and all were read again by the moderator. After several questions came in a few more direct challenges were addressed to the debaters. The topic switched from pornography to homosexuality. Someone seemed to be baiting Mr. Gross to preach scorn and brimstone about the tabu. Someone asked if the preacher had ever seen porn. He admitted that he had long before he became a preacher and that he couldn't escape being exposed to it at porn events. Then the discussion switched to the debate over the relative morality of masturbation. Back and forth they argued without reaching a decisive conclusion. Finally a woman heckled at the top of her lungs, "Woohooo! Masturbation! Yeaaaah!" The evening had finally hit its high point.

I wondered if fireflies masturbated and if they did, what happens to their light bulb butts?

Then the bomb was dropped. The moderator leveled his voice, "This question is for Ron Jeremy. Ron, how would you feel if your daughter wanted to go into porn?"

"Uhhh...I would tell her to masturbate!" Everyone laughed, including Mr. Gross. After the house settled a bit Ron finally admitted that "...it wouldn't be my first choice for her...but ultimately it's her decision."

Gross pointed out that God saw us in much the same way. That we're his children and that everything is ultimately our choice. He closed with the his main point of the evening. That religious voices in this country aren't all zealots, and that some humbly follow the teachings of Christ which included hanging out with prostitutes and bums in order to give them a hand when they asked for it. Finally, that staying true to spiritual ways of life people like himself naturally don't give in to urges to engage in secular pursuits such as pornography because that type of choice is ultimately incompatible with spirituality.

Then we adjourned for a meet and greet in the lobby where Mr. Jeremy autographed breasts and everyone was introduced to Ron's new line of products including Ron Jeremy Beef Jerky. Entertaining at the very least. After all how can you not love Ron Jeremy? God does.

[Josh]

I may have overlooked a note about it.....but did Ron push his "pornstar" clothing line at all?

[farzad]

you obviously didnt read the entire review